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diet in the millennium

posted Mar 19, 2017 14:42:02 by SusanMalone
Isaiah 65:25 indicates that in the millennium animals that are predators will have a miraculous change in their bodies, and will eat differently. It says that the wolf and the lamb shall feed together, and the lion shall eat straw like the bullock; and dust shall be the serpent's meat. They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain.

Then in D&C 89:4 we learn that the Lord gave us the word of wisdom by revelation because of evils and designs which will exist in the last days in the hearts of conspiring men (I think of this every time I see a tv commercial for pharmaceuticals or food). We all know the basics of word of wisdom compliance for a temple recommend. But is there more the Lord invites us to do to be healthier and thus better able to build Zion?

Verses 12-13 (one sentence): Yea, flesh also of beasts and of the fowls of the air, I, the Lord, have ordained for the use of man with thanksgiving; nevertheless they are to be used sparingly; and it is pleasing unto me that they should not be used, only in times of winter, or of cold, or famine. (I know there is a lot of controversy over that little comma after the word used, which was added later, but totally changes the meaning if it is there or is not- but the addition of that comma is what we have today, and it then fits as far as meaning with the other verses)

Verse 14 talks about grains for the staff of life for us and for animals

Verse 15: And these (footnote refers back to verse 13) hath God made for the use of man only in times of famine and excess of hunger.

It may be possible that we would please the Lord more if we did not eat meat except to save our lives- in the 4 conditions mentioned: famine (mentioned twice), excess of hunger, winter or cold. I have thought a lot about this information over the years. Since the Lord mentions these 4 conditions there must be some difference between famine and excess of hunger (unless it is a parallel structure?) and winter and cold. I had a friend who worked in a warehouse and it was so physically demanding that she could not eat enough to keep from losing weight. To me that is excess hunger even if there is no famine. Clearly in a famine the animals will starve as well, so thinning the herds is beneficial to those that survive as well.

But reading in Isaiah got me to wondering... if the animals will not be eating each other, would we be wrong in assuming we will be eating animals? Would we be wise to prepare now for a millennial diet? Would we be better prepared to endure what is ahead if we have more strength and stamina because we are feeding our bodies the way the Lord designed them?
verse 14: "All wholesome herbs (footnote references plants like fruits, herbs (vegetables), seeds and grains) God hath ordained for the constitution, nature, and use of man- every herb in the season thereof, and every fruit in the season thereof; all these to be used with prudence and thanksgiving.

So much I don't understand... in the season (when ripe? what about foods we preserve- are they still "in season"???), with prudence (skill and good judgment, caution as to danger or risk, using reason) and thanksgiving (looks like we need to make sure we are giving thanks for any food we have to eat!).

Anyway- those are just my musings about how to take care of my body. I was born into a non-member home and was not raised with the word of wisdom. I was raised on lots of sugar, dairy, meat, processed foods and few vegetables and fruits... I have struggled with several health issues and believe that health can be improved by improving my diet, not just using drugs to deal with symptoms. And now I wonder even more about how to prepare for the millennium.
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42 replies
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ElishaJones said Mar 19, 2017 23:26:43
Elder Ballard talks about honey in the October 2012 conference. Speaking of his father:

"Father loved his gentle honeybees and marveled at the way thousands of them working together transformed the nectar gathered from his peach blossoms into sweet, golden honey—one of nature’s most beneficial foods. In fact, nutritionists tell us it is one of the foods that includes all the substances—enzymes, vitamins, minerals, and water—necessary to sustain life."

Honey is a good thing.
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AliciaBlickfeldt said Mar 19, 2017 23:52:36
I have been strictly eating the Word of Wisdom for over 4 years now. It is life-changing! There is a time and a place for meat but, we do not live in famine... my personal understanding is that meat will be a necessity if and when we cannot get the other foods. We live in the most abundant country in the world! I feel like I have preached this to you before. LOL. Your body is organic and made from the earth, feed it the things from the Earth. It's really quite simple.
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Diana Olsen said Mar 20, 2017 01:16:14
All i know is, i really enjoyed my double cheese burger cooked on the BBQ grill today by my son in law. 😋
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Dawn said Mar 20, 2017 01:37:33
In answer to your question, I would say that yes, in the millenium, we will be living a vegetarian life. As to now, I think that is for each individual to decide. We are each unique with our own needs. If we seek after it, the Spirit will guide and invite what is best for us individually based on our learning, experience, willingness, etc.

What does the church say about the Word of Wisdom? We can debate it all day long if we want, but this is what it says. I am doubtful there is a single vegan apostle.

https://www.lds.org/topics/word-of-wisdom?lang=eng&old=true

We aren't on solid ground if we add to it or teach it officially. But, as I said before, we may be lead to something more committed. I have felt for years that vegetarian or near vegetarian is probably best. I've studied health and nutrition for decades. If my husband were more on board, we'd be far closer to that than we are. He teaches Institute, and actually it's more fair to say, that he would eat whatever I serve him if it tastes good and fills him. I am the weak link right now. Hoping some day life will be simpler and I can go back to actually planning meals. Having said that, I try new plant based meals regularly.

As far as Jane Birch goes, I have some opinions on that I should probably keep to myself. I've met her and found her rigid. No one will ever get me to believe we should have no fats and no animal products at all. My personal feeling is plant based includes all plants. Oils in small amounts are also very necessary to optimum health. I also feel that eggs and dairy are an easy way to supply protein without overburdening the body, if you aren't also eating tons of packaged foods and sugar. AND if also eaten in smaller amounts. (Yes, I know that there is protein in every plant and our protein needs are likely much smaller)

If the only things you did were 1) stop eating packaged food, 2) stop eating all refined sugars and limit natural ones, 3) drink more water (exclusively), and 4) increase dramatically fruits, nuts, seeds, and vegetables, most of our health problems in this nation would disappear within 1-3 months.

I applaud anyone who is moved upon by the Spirit to enhance health and spirituality where health is concerned. This is a VERY GOOD thing. But I have found many in the lds vegan camp to be extremely judgmental. I was on Jane's boards for a few months, and I just could't agree with a lot of it.

Because of more recent studies, including the relationship and proper combining of fats, proteins, and carbohydrates, and experimenting with that and seeing others heal from diseases as well as those who go vegan, I have much more pause about vegan lifestyle (FOR MYSELF and my family). And because I am now in a scientific nutritional program, I am just keeping my mind open and doing those things I know to work and I see working in others.

Once again, I applaud anyone trying to improve. Jane isn't the only author writing about the Word of Wisdom. This seems to be a well balanced one.

http://ldsmag.com/eggs-milk-cows-and-goats-word-of-wisdom-and-vegetarian-diets/
azdmarieatgmail
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ElishaJones said Mar 20, 2017 01:52:04
I appreciate your words, Dawn.
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NormJohnson said Mar 20, 2017 03:25:27
Tiffany good comment. I do believe we (I) eat to much meat but does not mean I do not grave a good ole Smash Burger once in awhile.

Ryan - a good laugh on that sourdough fish. Nice not to be so serious here on occasion.
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Amy Taula said Mar 20, 2017 03:31:46
Diana-😂😂
Dawn-I completely agree, especially with the four steps you listed. For me, personally, it is about what my body needs. I don't eat a lot of meat normally but when I am pregnant/nursing, I can feel when I drop in Iron or B12 so I usually eat lean, red meat and my body goes back into balance. Learning the WOW for me has been very much a line upon line doctrine and ultimately, has brought me to a place to know and love my body better.
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JenesseMoffett said Mar 20, 2017 03:33:19
I am strict vegetarian but I had to leave that FB group that was recommended earlier in this thread because - wow - no oil? Crazy.

My aversion to meat came right after a prayer to help me transition to a more Zion ready state. The blessings that have followed have included a thinner veil. I am forever grateful.

Also the food in the millennium will be changed too. Larger and much more nutritious and filling.
jenesse.moffett@gmail.com
Ang Sang Wahe Guru! (Every cell of my being Praises God who brings me from darkness into light)
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Isaiah said Mar 20, 2017 03:55:28
The Word of Wisdom is just that - a word of wisdom.
It is for our bodies. It's NOT spiritual.
You are not more spiritual because you don't eat meat.
For this the Lord has said
D&C 49:
18 And whoso forbiddeth to abstain from meats, that man should not eat the same, is not ordained of God;
19 For, behold, the beasts of the field and the fowls of the air, and that which cometh of the earth, is ordained for the use of man for food and for raiment, and that he might have in abundance.

I was a vegetarian for over 10 years and found out that many people
think they are superior and are spiritually above others for
not eating meat.
This is where you start getting into problems.

D&C 29

34 Wherefore, verily I say unto you that all things unto me are spiritual, and not at any time have I given unto you a law which was temporal; neither any man, nor the children of men; neither Adam, your father, whom I created.

35 Behold, I gave unto him that he should be an agent unto himself; and I gave unto him commandment, but no temporal commandment gave I unto him, for my commandments are spiritual; they are not natural nor temporal, neither carnal nor sensual.
"I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me."
Philippians 4:13
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Dawn said Mar 20, 2017 04:01:57
I do believe the word of wisdom is spiritual. Read the promised blessings. I admire anyone greatly who is vegetarian or vegan. Kudos. It's tough until you decide it isn't.:-)

It wouldn't surprise me at all if the W of W IS the Lord's preparatory diet for the Millenium. Those who comply now and go beyond when lead, will have it so much more easy.
azdmarieatgmail
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Isaiah said Mar 20, 2017 04:19:50

D&C 29

34 Wherefore, verily I say unto you that all things unto me are spiritual, and not at any time have I given unto you a law which was temporal; neither any man, nor the children of men; neither Adam, your father, whom I created.

35 Behold, I gave unto him that he should be an agent unto himself; and I gave unto him commandment, but no temporal commandment gave I unto him, for my commandments are spiritual; they are not natural nor temporal, neither carnal nor sensual.

Matthew 15:11
11 Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man.

18 But those things which proceed out of the mouth come forth from the heart; and they defile the man.

19 For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies:
[Last edited Mar 20, 2017 04:21:29]
"I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me."
Philippians 4:13
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SusanMalone said Mar 20, 2017 04:53:08
Thank you for all of your feedback. I am almost sorry I brought it up because I don't want any contention :(

I have been not only striving to understand the Word of Wisdom, and follow the Spirit in how to apply it in my life, but I have also spend awhile studying the science of nutrition. I love Forks Over Knives. I learned a lot from that movie. It has led me to many other food documentaries which were also educational.

One of my favorite websites is NutritionFacts.org It is by Dr Michael Greger. He is an MD who specialized in clinical nutrition and what the best available science is. I have been learning a lot at that site as well.

In the recent past I overcame debilitating hip pain by giving up eggs. Long story about how I came to know it was the eggs (we have chickens who are layers, and now give all the eggs away). My friend whom the doctor wanted to hospitalize with dangerously high blood pressure watched Forks Over Knives and changed her diet that day- giving up not only meat but all animal products. Cheese was her big problem, and within 30 days her blood pressure was normal when she returned to the doctor. The doctor was elated, talking about how she had never seen the prescribed medicine work that well before. Then my friend told her she never filled the prescription, she changed her diet. My husband is overcoming prostate cancer with our changing diet.

The Lord ordained animals for our food, but I have come to believe recently that he set bounds for their proper use. But He also allows us to choose for ourselves and he honors our choices. But that does not free us from the consequences of our choices. I do believe that we cause needless suffering by stubbornly choosing to continue to eat foods that are not good for us because we like them, or crave them. I think that leads us into bondage by subtle deception.

I believe the word of wisdom and it's warning about the evils and designs that exist in the hearts of conspiring men in the last days (our day)... when I learned that congress has known since the mid 1970s that we should eat mostly plants, minimal meet or sugar, but that McGovern report was squelched by big Agra (US Dept of Agriculture makes our dietary recommendations, but they represent the financial interests of farmers who raise animals for human consumption, which is different that farmers who raise just crops)- anyone see a conflict of interest here? Is it any wonder that food recommendation lean heavily toward meat, fish, eggs and dairy? Their recommendations are sadly, not based on science (see NutritionFacts for more details).

I am happy that I am beginning to feel better. I am grateful for all of you who shared your thoughts and feelings. I am very very sorry for any contention my question has caused. I have plenty to think about and ponder as I try to prepare for what lies ahead. Thank you again to all of you.

I hope each of you is led by the Spirit to do what is best for you- and that you can find your way through the mists of darkness and confusion, and conflicting information into the light the Lord has to give us in abundance. It sure seems that food and our emotional connections to it (no matter how we eat), may be stumbling blocks in and of themselves. I don't think anyone should feel superior to others for any reason, least of all for how we eat. We all need to be humble and obedient.
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Isaiah said Mar 20, 2017 04:57:32
http://www.mormonthink.com/wow.htm
Word of Wisdom
"The situation that arose to evoke the revelation started with a combination of the efforts of the Kirtland Temperance Society (founded in 1830 and predominantly non Mormon), who were opposed to alcohol, tobacco and eating too much meat; and Smith training men in his ‘School of Elders' every day, meeting in a small smoke filled room above Emma's kitchen, with tobacco juice being spit all over the floor.
Emma had the job of cleaning up following the meetings. The situation and results are available from several sources. This is just one:

Thus Emma, faced almost daily with “having to clean so filthy a floor” as was left by the men chewing tobacco, spoke to Joseph about the matter. Davis Whitmer's account supports Brigham Young's description. “Some of the men were excessive chewers of the filthy weed, and their disgusting slobbering and spitting caused Mrs. Smith … to make the ironical remark that ‘It would be a good thing if a revelation could be had declaring the use of tobacco a sin, and commanding it's suppression.' The matter was taken up and joked about, one of the brethren suggested that the revelation should also provide for a total abstinence from tea and coffee drinking, intending this as a counter ‘dig' at the sisters.” Sure enough the subject was afterward taken up in dead earnest, and the ‘Word of Wisdom' was the result. (David Whitmer). (Des Moines Daily News, 16 Oct 1886:20 c. in: Newell & Avery 1994:47, also c: An Historical Analysis of the Word of Wisdom, Paul H. Peterson - Masters Thesis, [no]; Also: c. in Tanner 1987:406. See also Tanner 1987: Ch. 26 for excellent coverage). (Emphasis added)."
"I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me."
Philippians 4:13
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Marilyn_Rigby said Mar 20, 2017 06:30:00
Interesting, sounds like they already knew intuitively what they should be doing, but hadn't thought to ask. When they asked (and were ready to listen), the answer was given.
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Jesse Slater said Mar 20, 2017 19:25:10
@normjohnson That scripture is a double negative. "And whoso ​​​forbiddeth​ to ​​​abstain​ from ​​​meats" is basically saying, "Whoever tells people to eat meat is not ordained of God."

@nikkimoshier ALKALINE BODIES destroy disease! I'm right there with ya. Ever since I stopped eating tons of meat and started making sure I'm eating alkaline foods I haven't been sick, and it's been more than two years! I also have a lot more energy. I've noticed that sugar has a MASSIVE effect on me now too (makes me tired and totally bogged down). It's a lot harder for me to feel the spirit on the Sabbath when I pig out and eat processed foods and sugars too!
[Last edited Mar 20, 2017 19:27:54]
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